This thread is probably going to end up just being me ranting about sports with Aaron and maybe a few other people responding every now and then, but the idea is that it's a place where users can discuss sports and anything and everything that happens in them (except TebowA)
I've been thinking about starting this thread for a while but I wasn't sure how it would go and was kind of hesitant; wasn't really sure how to start it but the steroid conversation in baseball is always a good topic to start a buzz on. So here goes.
The hall of fame yesterday voted on and announced the results for the class of 2014. The hall will induct three players and three managers this year. The players are Greg Maddux and Tom Glavine who are the first pitching duo to be inducted in the same class, and slugger Frank Thomas who will be the first true designated hitter inducted. The managers are Bobby Cox, Joe Torre, and Tony La Russa. Craig Biggio finished 2 votes shy of being inducted and Rafael Palmeiro and Jack Morris dropped off the ballot. So what does this all mean? It means another year that the hall closed its doors to steroid users. (Although there were once rumors about Frank Thomas, there has never been any evidence supporting it or reason to believe the rumors)
Here's my opinion of steroids in baseball. There's no denying that players cheated, I'm in no way supporting the use of steroids or those who use them. However, I think there are certain players that baseball should induct into the hall of fame which have not been inducted because of steroids. Here are my arguements:
1. The game was dirtier than the Manhattan River at the time, it's nearly impossible to know which players were using PED's and which weren't. How do you know someone you do induct was completely clean there whole career or that someone you're leaving off really didn't use them? You don't, no one does and we never will.
2. It wasn't a secret, Tony La Russa was manager of the Oakland Athletics in the late 80's early 90's when the team (led by Jose Canseco and Mark McGwire) introduced steroids to the game of baseball. Multiple players have admitted that steroid talk was common in the locker room and that everyone knew who was taking them and who wasn't. La Russa was also manager of the Cardinals when Mark McGwire played there. He was there in 1998 when McGwire not only broke the single season home run record but also was caught using nutritional supplement used to boost hormones (Androstenedione) Joe Torre no doubt knew which players were using it in his locker room as well. If we are inducting the managers who knew about and allowed steroids to be used then how is that any different than inducting the guys using it?
3. All of baseball knew and benefited from PED's. After the cocaine issues in the 80's and the baseball strike in 1994 baseball was suffering and the home run saved baseball. People were more excited to watch Sosa or McGwire hit a home run then see two pitchers duel it out in a one run game. The Home run chase of '98 and Barry Bonds resurrected major league baseball and everyone was gaining and profiting from it so everyone kept their mouths shut.
4. It's a part of baseball history. That's what the hall of fame is for, to show the history of major league baseball, good and bad. Babe Ruth and Lou Gerhig never played against african american players, why are they in if they were cheating the system too but not allowing black players? When you open the league up to everyone chances are you'll get more talent then with just one race, that means more competition and a tougher claim to fame. I have no doubt that Gerhig and Ruth would have still been great but I also believe Bonds and Clemens would have been great even without the steroids.
Yes you can argue that it was there decision to use them and risk tarnishing their achievements but it was pitchers on juice going against batters on juice. I think the hall is worried about sending the wrong image that they accept steroid users and you can use PEDs and still be immortalized. I don't think this would send that image (even though at the time, they did approve).
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I realize I wrote a lot, most of my posts in here will probably be long rants like that but it would be nice if other people replied or brought up topics too. This is a list of recent events that could start some conversation. I'm not going to write about them now but it's just to get some ideas going
ATebow gets enough media hype lets leave him out of this
I've been thinking about starting this thread for a while but I wasn't sure how it would go and was kind of hesitant; wasn't really sure how to start it but the steroid conversation in baseball is always a good topic to start a buzz on. So here goes.
The hall of fame yesterday voted on and announced the results for the class of 2014. The hall will induct three players and three managers this year. The players are Greg Maddux and Tom Glavine who are the first pitching duo to be inducted in the same class, and slugger Frank Thomas who will be the first true designated hitter inducted. The managers are Bobby Cox, Joe Torre, and Tony La Russa. Craig Biggio finished 2 votes shy of being inducted and Rafael Palmeiro and Jack Morris dropped off the ballot. So what does this all mean? It means another year that the hall closed its doors to steroid users. (Although there were once rumors about Frank Thomas, there has never been any evidence supporting it or reason to believe the rumors)
Here's my opinion of steroids in baseball. There's no denying that players cheated, I'm in no way supporting the use of steroids or those who use them. However, I think there are certain players that baseball should induct into the hall of fame which have not been inducted because of steroids. Here are my arguements:
1. The game was dirtier than the Manhattan River at the time, it's nearly impossible to know which players were using PED's and which weren't. How do you know someone you do induct was completely clean there whole career or that someone you're leaving off really didn't use them? You don't, no one does and we never will.
2. It wasn't a secret, Tony La Russa was manager of the Oakland Athletics in the late 80's early 90's when the team (led by Jose Canseco and Mark McGwire) introduced steroids to the game of baseball. Multiple players have admitted that steroid talk was common in the locker room and that everyone knew who was taking them and who wasn't. La Russa was also manager of the Cardinals when Mark McGwire played there. He was there in 1998 when McGwire not only broke the single season home run record but also was caught using nutritional supplement used to boost hormones (Androstenedione) Joe Torre no doubt knew which players were using it in his locker room as well. If we are inducting the managers who knew about and allowed steroids to be used then how is that any different than inducting the guys using it?
3. All of baseball knew and benefited from PED's. After the cocaine issues in the 80's and the baseball strike in 1994 baseball was suffering and the home run saved baseball. People were more excited to watch Sosa or McGwire hit a home run then see two pitchers duel it out in a one run game. The Home run chase of '98 and Barry Bonds resurrected major league baseball and everyone was gaining and profiting from it so everyone kept their mouths shut.
4. It's a part of baseball history. That's what the hall of fame is for, to show the history of major league baseball, good and bad. Babe Ruth and Lou Gerhig never played against african american players, why are they in if they were cheating the system too but not allowing black players? When you open the league up to everyone chances are you'll get more talent then with just one race, that means more competition and a tougher claim to fame. I have no doubt that Gerhig and Ruth would have still been great but I also believe Bonds and Clemens would have been great even without the steroids.
Yes you can argue that it was there decision to use them and risk tarnishing their achievements but it was pitchers on juice going against batters on juice. I think the hall is worried about sending the wrong image that they accept steroid users and you can use PEDs and still be immortalized. I don't think this would send that image (even though at the time, they did approve).
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I realize I wrote a lot, most of my posts in here will probably be long rants like that but it would be nice if other people replied or brought up topics too. This is a list of recent events that could start some conversation. I'm not going to write about them now but it's just to get some ideas going
- FSU/Auburn/National Championship or any bowl game
- Johnny Manzeil is always talked about
- NFL playoffs (predictions, teams you like/dislike, whatever)
- Olympics
- Coaching carrosel (in the NFL or college)
- College basketball
- ANYTHING!!!
ATebow gets enough media hype lets leave him out of this